012 - How To Grow A Hyper Profitable Ad Agency With Cody Winn

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Facebook biz page: @marketmodern
Personal Facebook Page: https://www.facebook.com/cody.winn.35
Instagram: @codyclaywinn
Email : cody@marketmodern.biz

Show Notes

Josh Tapp 0:01
What's up everybody? Josh Tapp here again, and welcome back to the lucky entrepreneur podcast. So today I've got Cody win on the mic. And Cody is a 21 year old entrepreneur who was able to scale his business from zero to over six figures in just under seven months, because he was able to leverage irresistible offers. So I invited Cody on the mic today to be able to share with us how he does his customer research how he's able to go out find exactly what customers want, so that he can provide it to them. And then his exact strategy that he uses to collect that research and to create offers that nobody else is offering so that he can become number one in his industry. Cody has been able to go out and teach many different agency owners to be able to scale their agencies in the same way that he has, as well as providing the service to multiple other businesses. So with that, Cody let's hop right in. All right, Cody, so let me ask you this first. So tell me something about yourself that most people don't know.
Cody Winn 0:59
Oh, something about myself that people don't know. When I am not working, I am generally doing a lot of ministry work. So that's kind of my my nighttime gig, I guess you could say is helping focus on serving people who struggle with drug addiction. That's awesome, man.
Josh Tapp 1:16
Yeah, it's really fulfilling thing to be able to spend your time and doing.
Unknown Speaker 1:19
So I would. Absolutely, yeah.
Josh Tapp 1:22
Well, so let me ask you this, then now that we've got that, right, we've got that question. I've been able to learn a little bit about you right, in our free or beginning interview there. But I want to ask you, so how did you get into marketing initially?
Cody Winn 1:34
Sure. So I had started by hearing a term called affiliate marketing, which I had no idea what it meant at the time, and I started doing some research into it. And then I didn't take it seriously. But, you know, my dad's an entrepreneur, and he does nothing similar to what I do now. But I've just always had that passion for owning my own business. And really, the goal was always to own a business to be able to fund the full time ministry that I wanted to do. So that was Kind of the dream and then I had heard Alex Becker out of all people. He he had, you know, talked about the whole drop shipping thing. And I, I tried, I tried that, and I hated it. I just hated the idea of, you know, selling crap from China and making somebody wait six weeks to get it. Right. Not not saying that it's not profitable, or anything like that. I just, I just wasn't very interested in it. And I watched one of his YouTube videos one day, and he said, Why do you waste your time selling low ticket dollar items and trying to make you know, you know, these 10% margins and all this stuff. He said, the way that you can have success in the business world is by selling high ticket dollar items. And it just kind of clicked for me. I was like, oh, like, marketing kind of stuff like that. People are selling these packages for like, four figures a month. And I was like, I can just get 10 of those, like, I'm doing really well. Right now in our zoo. We're seeing that it's way higher than even 10 that you can get of course. But yeah, so that's what kind of got me into it. And then I got myself a mentor to teach me which I'll go on a two second tangent here. You know, I often hear people complain about why is this guy's course? $2,000? Or why is that guy's coaching program? 8000? And it's like, okay, hold up, you know, first off, I want to be clear, you don't have to get any of those programs or whatever, or coaching and you'll be 100% fine. It'll just take you about four times as long to have success, right, if not longer, so there's no question that you don't need these things. But But is it worth the investment? I mean, it seems like a total no brainer to me that get somebody who's smarter than you who's been there. invest into yourself and you'll watch yourself scale way quicker than then your average Joe well, so I got myself a mentor, and kind of the rest is history from there. I love that.
Josh Tapp 3:39
So I don't know if he'd allow you to and up Would you be willing to share kind of who you went to when you you know, we're looking for mentorship?
Cody Winn 3:46
Yeah, sure. So, um, so it's a buddy of mine. His name is Jamil and and he has been there through thick and thin everything that I've had questions about and whatnot and he's been a huge help for me. And then outside of that, I've just been Part of a Facebook group that is kind of like a group of marketers who it's something you have to pay to get into, it's not just like a free, like Click Funnels kind of thing around. And, and we're kind of like there for each other to just talk about, you know, what people struggle with and stuff like that. So it's really quite a few steps higher than any of those popular Facebook groups that a lot of entrepreneurs are in,
Josh Tapp 4:20
right? Where I love that you mentioned that about, you know, being willing to spend the money because I personally, I mean, we invest anywhere from 15 to $20,000 a year in coaching and those type of things, and that has been the needle mover in our company. Because like you're saying, I mean, you could take the time and learn it all and make a bunch of mistakes, waste a lot of money, but it almost saves you money and time to just go out and pay somebody else who knows what they're talking about.
Cody Winn 4:44
erode that 100% and yeah, I mean, it's like that and, and really anything you know, most of these people's pitches when they sell you a program or something like that is Hey, start this niche or this industry or whatever, because it's very little out of pocket expense to start and that's true. It can be But what I tell people is the opposite. I'm like, spend as much as you can at the beginning, show somebody in yourself that you're willing to really invest in yourself and into your company. And watch yourself explode. I mean, look at the biggest companies in the world. The one thing that sets one of the things I should say, that set them apart is they started off investing into themselves. And it was like investing a lot like to the point where like, faith is involved to where it's like, I'm not exactly sure if this is even gonna pan out. But it's a calculated risk. And I mean, we see how it works out for people.
Josh Tapp 5:28
I love that. So invest until faith is involved. Right? Yeah, that's that's your new catchphrase.
Unknown Speaker 5:34
Right? Yeah.
Josh Tapp 5:37
Yeah, I think that's really interesting, really awesome concept, man. Well, so yeah, dive into a little bit about where you're at. I mean, what you're doing in your marketing agency, and, you know, kind of how you're growing your team and everything.
Cody Winn 5:49
Sure. Yeah. So um, so you know, I started just doing everything alone and kind of learning the ropes and kind of on the same thing as investing in yourself, you know, as an entrepreneur. You're not the best at everything. Just be honest with yourself, be humble about it. You suck at certain things. I mean, straight up, I suck at certain things. And I know that. And I'm comfortable with admitting that because that's why we hire people, right? We hire people, because we know that they're better at it than we are. So why would we hire somebody and try to tell them all the things that we want them to do? odds? Are they doing pretty well, which is why you're hiring them in the first place. Of course, you've got to, you know, get a specific to your industry and whatnot. But just in general, we hire people because they're better at it than us. So very quickly, I started hiring people because I realized, hey, what if my conversion rate on closing leads maybe could be 20% higher? Would it be worth giving a closer, you know, X percent? And I did the math, I was like, Well, absolutely. So let's hire him today. So I hired and hired and higher than and then just kind of tried to find a niche for myself, which was, you know, generally one of the biggest issues that you see for people today is they really struggle finding the niche. What is the perfect niche? Well, for starters, there's just no such thing as the perfect niche. You know, if there's a niche that you can make money off of, it's a good niche period. You know, one of one of people's dangers is we've all heard of the whole shiny object syndrome of, we see the new greatest and best thing or the new one that people are making six figures out. And it's like, well, let's just jump to that one that's like, no stop, find one that you know is going to have some sort of success and stick with it. The reason so many agency owners out there are failing so badly, is because they don't actually stick with one thing and fight for they'll do it for about two, three weeks and go, Oh, I didn't get the results I want and then move to the next one, you will never succeed that way. Right? Stick with one. And you know, I'm looking at the niches that we're in and I'm going, heck, you know, I could probably move to a different niche and maybe make more money or do something differently. But I'm like, what we're doing is working really, really, really well. And I want to perfect this until we can't get it any more efficient or optimized. And then maybe we will consider moving on to something else. But right now, until I think that our results are literally 100% perfect, then we're not going to move on so because I don't see any reason to so So, so first off we niched down, started hiring people on. And then as we hired people who knew how to do what we needed them to do better than we even knew. We just saw our sales and whatnot skyrocket.
Josh Tapp 8:13
Right? That's so awesome. So just to kind of refresh, our listeners are added on there. I mean, so Cody started his agency not even seven months ago, and was able to scale it to about 26 team members make a six figure income for himself. I mean, that's, that's pretty impressive to be able to take it that far that fast. So I mean, what are some of the key needle movers for you and being able to take it that far?
Cody Winn 8:34
Sure. No, absolutely. I would say, you know, investing into having people that you outsource to is a huge part of that. So So that was one of the big things that I can't stress enough because, you know, just ask yourself right now, are you trying to get past that five clients a month, because if you are, then you've got to outsource. I mean, you've got to have other team members because you just can't do it all yourself. And you don't want to do it all yourself, but you're just going to wear yourself out. Right and then So So that's, that's one of the huge parts is outsourcing things. And then the other part is lead generation. So this is the big thing, there's really if I can break a digital marketing agency down, it's got three points to it. It's got lead generation, it's got closing and it's got fulfillment which means, you know, creating the ads doing the SEO guy AdWords, so on and so forth. So so really with those three points, your business look at those three points and ask yourself, which of these Am I am I hurting in? Or which of all maybe you're sucking at all three of them? Right? What are you not doing well right now and and find somebody who's good at it and outsource it to them. And it's really hypocritical and people go, well, Cody, you expect me to spend 20 $500 a month with this person to do lead gen, or you expect me to just spend, you know, give 50% of my my profits to a closer? Yeah, I do. Aren't you asking people to spend four figures a month with your agency, then how critical would it be for you to not want to do that with somebody else, you know, because again, it's it's something that is going to scale you business. So it's it's again, it's a calculated risk to take, find somebody out there that has good testimonials. People have good things to say about them and outsource to that person. And I guarantee you'll see your your success change and and just exponentially grow. So between outsourcing to a team and the Legion, part of that this is like the biggest part that I can't stress enough is, is you've got to keep your pipeline full. Because again, the whole the other two points which are closing and fulfillment, they don't exist if you don't have leads coming in. Right, keeping your pipeline full constantly is so important. And on that here's here's another really big tip for you agency owners out there. You want to know the best way to get leads. It seems like this is never talked about. I don't really know why but but I'll give it to you for free. run ads for your own agency. You're supposedly so great at Legion, write for other clients, then then run it for your own agency, run your own ads on whatever platform that you'd like to use the most. And you will be able to generate leads for yourself and a lot Have them, I certainly have it because the first month our agency ran Facebook ads for ourself, we got over 60 leads in the first month, an average cost per lead at like three to $5. Wow.
Josh Tapp 11:14
Now I'm sure a lot of people are gonna want to know follow up to that. I mean, when you're, when you're making those ads for yourself, are you just using kind of testimonials? Or how are you going about making those?
Cody Winn 11:23
Great question. So we do we do quite a few different things. And I also want to clarify with an agency our size, we do lead gen on quite a few different platforms now. So it's not just Facebook ads, but that's just one place. I would start off if you're not doing paid advertisement yet. Right. But But yeah, what we do is we pretty much we do do testimonials, but we focus on even more than that. Just having that irresistible offer. You know, we hear this a lot and courses and all these gurus and stuff, but this is something you should really consider is is your offer really does need to be irresistible. Here's what I mean. Let's say that you reach out to gym owners
Or Cairo or something? And these are generally pretty saturated markets. Right? I don't really believe in a too saturated market. I don't think that exists. I think that you just need to change your implementation of outreach and whatnot to be able to get them I don't think there's such thing as too saturated, but, you know, those are the more popular markets and and with those, you know, the average Joe, what they do is they, their, their offer sounds something like this, we can bring you 30 to 50 leads every single month on autopilot. Okay, right. You and everybody else out there has the exact same pitch. And the exact same pitch is not very intriguing to people because they've heard it 5000 times. Now, let me put it in even more perspective. I have talked to when I very first started the very first person I ever reached out to was a dentist office, because I was like, Oh, this makes so much sense like Invisalign. And then again, I figured out everybody else in their brother wanted to do the same thing. So I ended up doing my my avatar research and I ended up figuring out these people get about 15 emails a day from People like us, we got 15 emails a day from people like us all offering the exact same thing. So convinced me that somebody is even going to listen or read your whole email, I mean, it's a complete waste, especially when you're offering the exact same thing as everybody else. So in my Facebook ads, what our agency does is we offer something truly irresistible. So that means that we're offering something other than just 30 to 50 weeks, because we want to stand out, we want to be different. And with that being said, You know, I suggest people consider at least reaching out to maybe not chiropractics and gems and dentists, because there's like the big ones med spots, like there's the big ones that everyone goes after. Try for some more unique ones that not everybody's reaching out to. And you'll have a much, much greater chance of closing these deals, because they're not so used to getting smacked in the face with this stuff all the time. But secondly, make your deal different than everybody else's. You know, I can't, I can't spoon feed this one to you, but just think about what your client needs and meet that need of them. How do I know what your client needs? While you're not doing To know what your client needs, until you do your avatar research, this is the part of the business that no one wants to do. It's not fun. It's not crazy, you're not making any money off of it technically like in and of itself. But this is such a crucial part of your lead generation process that if you miss this one thing, everything else is going to be very ineffective for you. So what do I mean when I say avatar research? What I mean is, you need to know your client, your your perfect prospect, you need to know that person better than they know themselves. So let's take a chiropractic for example, again, you know, what is something that you could offer them that would make them say, there's no way I could say no to that deal? That's what we're trying to do here. And again, the whole just offering leads is not that thing. I know because, again, you and everybody else wants to do that. So you've got to you've got to position it in different way. And how do I know what that different way is? Well, I personally don't work with auto chiropractors, so I don't necessarily know exactly exactly what it is that a chiropractor once, but this is where that research comes in. Here's just a simple tip and how you can do that, well, I want you to go today and find somebody in your industry, look them up in a different state so that it doesn't seem awkward or whatever, and call them and say, Hey, I am a student of digital marketing. Again, this takes a bit of humility. Just Humble yourself and call him say, Hey, I'm a student of digital marketing. I'm just trying to learn about what my clients want better. So can you tell me the kinds of things that you guys are interested in? In regards to marketing? That would make you just say, yes, anything? I mean, literally, just ask them that. I mean, right. If you call five people, I bet one would be kind enough to just give you the answers that question. I literally just did that today. I kid you not I mean, agency. I've got 26 teammates on my team. And we just did that today. Because we never want to stop learning and those kinds of things. So what did I do? I literally typed in. I typed in the niche that we were interested in and I just typed in Austin, Texas. I don't live in Austin, Texas, but I literally typed it in called the first person I saw. I said, Hey, can I just ask you some questions and guess what I got? So much valuable information. I'm we will close, I'm serious when I say I bet we're gonna close 20 to 30% more deals just by the information that I got from these people. And it took me what 1020 maybe an hour. I mean, it's absolutely worth it. So first off, understand your client before you do anything else. Second off, I would suggest testing it on a cold audience if you haven't yet, or excuse me, an organic audience. So don't spend money on paid advertisements, if you don't know that this is something that the market actually wants. And then lastly, after you figure out something that people want, run your own ads for and I guarantee you, you will watch the amount of leads and close deals that come in, you'll see it'll just go through the roof.
Josh Tapp 16:43
Right? Well, what I love about your process, what you're saying, I mean, really any business, you should be doing this. And if you're not able, and I really liked your method, I mean call your customer figure out you know what exactly they need and then you move forward. Right, so good to have a specific question from you from one of our listeners. I'm He was asking, so he's a lawyer just started up as his own firm. And so you're a full service marketing agency, right? You've been able to do multiple different forms of marketing. What credit area? Would you recommend him advertising? Would it be better to do Google PPC? I mean, a billboard what would you expect him to do?
Cody Winn 17:17
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. You know, it tends to be that I see lawyers, at least they tend to do the billboard thing most often. And just a little short segment on billboards here. Again, I'm not saying they don't work, nothing that can't work. But you know, you're spending anywhere around 3500 to 40 $500 per month generally, for a billboard. And these billboards, you know, when when you're trying to as a lawyer, when you're trying to reach your perfect client, you're looking at somebody I don't know exactly what specific profession he's in, in doing his lawyer work, but you know, you're looking at probably somebody in the range of 25 to 50. And you know, you want them in a specific situation. So, you know, I don't know if it's a Divorce, Divorce or injury lawyer or whatever, but you For a very specific type of person, how do you show a very specific type of person? You're your advertisement when it's on a billboard. I mean, you've got kids sing it, you've got you've got, you know, people in nursing homes singer who might not be, you know, your kind of prospect you're looking for. So my point is, is there's no way to track it. And there's no way to actually optimize on those people that you're looking for. So this is why, especially with the digital world becoming more and more prevalent for marketing, I couldn't suggest more that you stick with something in the digital world, because it's all trackable. You can change things, you can optimize things. So with that being said, there's one of a few different spots I would I would really encourage you to do. It kind of depends on on how much you're willing to spend them on, and what results you're actually looking for. Most people today, it seems like they're moving more towards the Facebook ads side of things. And absolutely, Facebook ads can work and they can be super effective for you and they get you results virtually overnight, quote unquote. So that's definitely an effective route we've seen. We've done it for a long And seeing tremendous success for lawyers. With that being said, I suggest at some point, every company that is doing, you know, more than $200,000 a year in sales, I really can't stress enough that you do SEO. And the reason for that is, is that's the most effective form of advertisement you can do. Because these are people who are actually looking for you, you're going to rank if you don't know what SEO is search engine optimization, simply means that you're going to rank at the very top of a Google search. So when you Google iPhone cases, or whatever, and that first one that you see after the ads comes up, that is what SEO does for people. Right? So so this is really huge for lawyers, because generally, this is something that you know, something came across in your life, whether you got injured, or you're getting a divorce or whatever. And now you need a lawyer. So you're gonna go to Google anyways. And this is why I suggest SEO be that thing because a lot of people generally skip those PPC ads, which was running ads that you see at the very top. Again, those can be extremely effective as well. But a lot of people skip them. And they'll just go to the first result they see. And very few people go past the second page ever on Google. Right. So with that being said, I mean, that's why that's such prime real estate for you. The only downside of SEO that people don't like is you don't get results overnight. This is a process it takes about four to six months. But to put it into perspective for you, lawyer or any other kind of entrepreneur out there listening, did you start your business in one month and just have life changing results? No, you did not. Very, very, very rarely does that ever happen. It's a process it takes time. It's not a get rich quick scheme. Marketing is not get rich quick. It is simply a way to be able to get you more results more consistently. And it's something that you can absolutely scale and make a whole lot of money with. This is why the biggest brands in the world do it. But with that being said, it's still not get rich quick. So in the same way, why would you have a concern with waiting four to six months to get really really really incredible results for the rest of your life. said it's an investment. It takes a little bit of quote unquote faith, I guess. But I mean, SEO is such a huge opportunity for people as lawyers to do so I would suggest going that route. If you're saying, hey, Cody, I'm kind of new to this. I just need some results and get some money and quick, then yeah, I would go with either PPC or Facebook ads. I suggest Facebook ads because our agency, we've just seen such effective results with Facebook ads, but Google can get the same type of results for you.
Josh Tapp 21:26
I love that. Awesome. Thanks, Cody. Well, before we sign off, I mean, what's one one last piece of parting guidance and tell our listeners know where they can connect with you and how they can get in contact with you?
Cody Winn 21:35
Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah, so last bit of advice I can give you, you know, if you are in the starting phase of your business, the best thing I can say to you is stop learning so much information and start implementing it. You know, implement, implement, implement, apply what you have already learned, and just go out there and work hard. You know, the only reason that that I ever care printers fail is because they give up. I know that sounds super simple. I'm not trying to oversimplify things. But if you just work hard at anything, you can make money as an entrepreneur doing literally anything you want. So work hard, don't give up. It's not a two hour a week thing. I mean, this when I first started my agency, I went from being the manager of a company, to being able to quit my job, replace my salary and do marketing full time in three weeks. Everyone's like, Whoa, see, I mean, it's a it's get rich quick, right? It's like, No, it's not. It took me 12 hours a day, including while I was at work, I was sneaking back on my computer just to do more work well, hours every single day without fail for three weeks straight. And that doesn't include about a month and a half before that, that I just spent learning every single day. So it takes hard work. It's not easy. I'm not gonna say it's easy, but it's so worth it if you will take the time and really fight for it, and really implement what you're learning. And then my second part is for people who have already started the business, you're established, you're making good money. What's the next step for me? Well, if you are not a marketing agency, I would strongly urge you to work with some sort of agency who's had success, someone who has effective results and really grow and scale and take yourself to that next level because odds are you want to be making more money, right? Well, what kind of plan do you have in place right now to do that, odds are you have little to nothing. And do you want to be in the same spot next month as you were this month? No, you don't. You want to be able to scale consistently, and really be able to make an impact in your life and the people around you. So that's really my advice for somebody who's not an agency owner. And if you are an agency owner, paid ads. I can give you as like paid ads. Get keep that pipeline full. Yeah, ask for referrals. Do all that fun stuff, but that only goes so far. Use paid advertisement. You won't regret it as long as you have that irresistible offer you're talking about. And then in regards to where to find me, you can either find me on Facebook at market modern is our Facebook page. You can add me as a personal friend, Cody, when is my name cod wide wi n n or If you want to hit me up on Instagram, you're more than welcome to do that at Cody clay. When is my, my Instagram handle? And I think those are the only places if you want to shoot us an email if you want some more information about what it is that we do, or how we can help Cody at market modern dot biz bi z is our email address.
Josh Tapp 24:19
Awesome. co you will also throw links to all of those within the description of the podcast as well so people can reach out to you. And Awesome. Thank you for coming on our show.
Cody Winn 24:28
Thank you, man. Thank you for having me. I really appreciate it.
Josh Tapp 24:31
Do you ever feel overwhelmed by all of the software's and tools that call for your attention and for your money, but you never know which ones work well for your business. I personally have worked with over 100 companies and every single company has different tools that work well for them. But I found a few specific tools that work well for every business and I've made a resources page that you can access at the lucky entrepreneur.com slash resources. On that page. We've got trainings that will teach you how to use the tools effectively what businesses they work best for, and then how to access them and get discounts on them. Then all through our resources page, so if you'd like access to those resources go to the lucky entrepreneur.com slash resources. Once again, that's the lucky entrepreneur.com slash resources.
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